I messed up. You're using too much detergent. technology connections dishwasher

by autisticchiaNGMAI



New rule: instructions on how to use the consumable thing from those who are incentivized to keep selling it to you ought not be trusted.
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00:00 Intro
00:29 A Quick Overview
01:26 Why I’m making this video and an apology
02:02 Testimonials
02:38 No pre-wash spot doesn’t mean no pre-wash happens
03:09 A note about Express/Quick/Eco/Whatever settings
04:28 MY TERRIBLE MISTAKE (I’m sorry!)
06:27 Detergents and Hard Water
08:02 You can use way less detergent than the box says
09:29 When to use more
10:46 Tests! Experiments!
14:31 “No Pre-Wash!” on the box doesn’t mean what you think it means
15:51 What about independent lab tests?
16:57 My varied dishwasher life experience
18:06 Co-marketing agreements of doom
20:16 Chemicals in detergent pacs vs powder
23:39 Cost comparison
26:02 A quick note on packaging waste
26:24 The Downside to Gels
29:08 But Gels aren’t all bad
31:18 Do powder detergents have abrasives in them?
32:14 Rinse Aids (use them!)
33:38 Dishwasher cleaning and maintenance (do it!)
34:58 Dishwasher salt
36:16 Mostly snarky rants from here on out
46:34 Bloopers

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I messed up. You're using too much detergent.

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I messed up. You're using too much detergent.
technology connections dishwasher
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32 comments

defenestrated23 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

cracks knuckles Chemistry expert and former detergent chemist here, chiming in. Modulo some small semantic differences, you're 100% spot on. Functionally, there is zero difference in the formulations. Every powder dish detergent on the market comprises the same functional components, though the exact chemicals selected may vary. It's always some combination of detergent, anti-deposition agent, water conditioners, strong base, oxidizers, enzymes, buffers, "processing aids", and what I call "foo foo juice" – colors and fragrances.

The Purpose section is annoyingly vague so I'm going to break down each of the categories and give their examples. These aren't strict categories, in fact many of these chemicals perform double or even triple duty.

Detergent/Surfactant – Allows water to bind grease molecules by virtue of having two halves, hydrophilic (water loving) and hydrophobic (water hating or grease-binding). These can be basic/anionic (negative charge): sodium lauryl sulfate (SLS); neutral: isotridecanol ethoxylated, PEG C10. Acidic/cationic (positive) are uncommon in dish detergents but you may see them in rinse aids. Bonus fact: rinse aids are typically mild acids ( pH about 3) which helps dissolve calcium deposits and soap scum. Because of this, they have to use neutral or cationic surfactants.

Anti-deposition agent – Once you dissolve the grease, you don't want it to deposit back onto the dishes. Cascade calls this "boosts shine" but it's basically film prevention. The line between detergent and anti-deposition agent is blurry, and many chemicals can fulfill both roles. Acrylic copolymers are the best example here, but the PEGs (polyethylene glycol) also help in this regard, as do any neutral detergents. They tend to be weak detergents on their own, but their big advantage is they don't create soap scum (calcium fatty acids, more on that later).

Water conditioners and chelators – Hard water means calcium, iron, and other large positive ions in solution. Calcium reacts with anionic surfactants (aka soaps) to form insoluble scum. This both reduces cleaning power and makes extra goop that needs to be cleaned! Water conditioners exchange sodium for calcium, binding it so it doesn't form scum. This category includes polycarboxylates, citric acid, sodium phosphate (discontinued), EDTA, and our friend sodium acrylate/maleic/carboxylate copolymers again (yes it doubles as both anti-deposition and water conditioner. Synergy!).

Strong base – Anionic detergents work best at a high pH (alkaline/basic). Alkali also saponifies grease, giving it a hydrophilic group and turning it into soap! Lye (sodium hydroxide), bleach (sodium hypochlorite), sodium percarbonate aka sodium carbonate peroxide aka "OxyClean", sodium silicate, and sodium phosphate are all strong bases. See all that sodium? They also help condition water as well!

Oxidizers – These react with staining molecules such as tomato sauce, berries, tea, and coffee, as well as natural polymers like proteins (cheese) to break them apart. Sodium hypochlorite and percarbonate are oxidisers. "Transition metal catalyst" has a similar role, except instead of being consumed, it facilitates the bleaching action.

Enzymes – Starch and protein when heated and hydrated form a natural glue of sorts. Anyone dealing with stuck-on cheese or rice knows what I'm talking about. Enzymes are natural molecules that break these polymers down so they unstick from surfaces. Amylase specifically digests amylose (starch) and Subtilisin (protease) breaks down protein. Pro-tip: any time in biology you see whatever-ase, that breaks down _whatever_.

Buffers – prevent the base from being too basic and etching glassware. I think this is what zinc carbonate is doing, but I'm not 100% sure.

Processing Aid – Any time you see "processing aid" or "enables liquid processing" – that just means it's an inert bulk transport, because either the active ingredient is too viscous, or cakes easily, or whatever. Glycerin and Dipropylene glycol act as liquid solvents in those colorful liquid sections of the gel packs, since too much water would dissolve the pack. Sodium sulfate is just an inert powder.

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Nana Minamino 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

HAHHAHAHA The good old " I wash the dishes faster than the machine!" line. I've heard it so many times.
Like whose waiting on the dishes? Totally missing the point, I'm sure everyone here agrees time is better spent doing other things!
Thanks for the video, always very informative and entertaining. People who wanted to fight you over the water levels obviously never looked at their manuals before.

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Mark Axford 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I lost track of my bad joke groans about 15 min in

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01wcutle 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Don't know if i'm to late to this party but these two videos were the first time i had ever heard of dishwasher powder. after an albeit brief search of my local shops I've found one brand that still sells this in the UK. my parents had a dishwasher in the late 90's and im almost certain they have always used tabs. having watched these videos im a little upset that i don't have the option to buy powder but i'll keep looking. my current method is one tab thrown into the main wash compartment and one in the dispenser. Brilliant video though thank you 🙂

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Marika Miettinen 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Maybe I'll have to play around with the detergents a bit more. Got my dishwasher 3 years ago and at first I still had to pre-wash everything by hand because I was using the shortest wash option. These days I just use the longest and strongest one, and still sometimes there's a plate or 2 that still has some gunk on it, some tiny tiny bits of something. The same kind of stuff gets left behind on top of mugs if they have a bottom that likes to retain water. It's super annoying. I've been using the detergent packages, really cheap ones though, and they wouldn't dissolve properly and occasionally the door to the detergent thingy wouldn't open at all or properly and I was left with a pile of partially dissolved detergent, so I just started throwing it into the dishwasher all willy nilly. If I do a shorter was cycle for some reason, then I use some gel. Sadly I couldn't find this one gel I had before, actually I started using the packets because I couldn't find that gel anymore. I don't think I've had any loose washing powders for the dishwasher.

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Oliver Lemley 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Me who doesn't own a dishwasher a yes a fifty minute video about how to maximize my dishwasher usage

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herauthon four 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

The concept of School, Class, Room, bad ventilation – all perfectly Solved… Right here 😀

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Graham Dean 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

So pleased for you that you can afford a dishwasher. Yes the 10 cents makes a difference. Look after the pennies and the pounds will look after themselves 🙂

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Root Smudge 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

If anyone needed to know this, the packets work pretty well as toilet bowl cleaner, in a pinch. Incase anyone is thinking of switching to powder or gel and needs something to do with their leftover packets.

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Kate 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I clean mine with baking sodium and vinegar and scrub then I usually will run a cycling with some regular soap and another cup of vinegar to help with the smell and it works. I haven't had anything really bad stuck in there at all so I stick to this method and it works great.

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Ivan Ivanov 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I'm very sorry there isn't any magic (20:10). But it's real life, not life from the commercials.
By the way, a very good example of a sit-down comedy. May be I should produce some other word of describing your standup comedy while sitting down, but I hope that you will understand me correctly.

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Chris Waterguy 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

In defence of eco wash cycle: if you've got a load that isn't very soiled, the eco wash should do a good job.
IIUC it just takes longer, giving more time for the water and detergent to do their thing. That's more efficient than blasting it with more heat and water.
But good to know about the pre-wash detergent thing – I'll definitely use that because usually we've got enough soiling to justify it.

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Alexandra 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

First video I’ve seen of yours. Love your personality along with all of the good info you provide. New subscriber.

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Adam Cooper 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Would you ever do one of these for washing machines and detergent?! Please??!!

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conni2you 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I just wanna say thank you. I am watching this video and the one you did before this one about dishwashers because I have been getting a residue on all my dishes or they just have not been getting clean after using dishwashing packs or tabs. It has been happening for many years and I just did not understand what the issue was. It got to the point where I started adding a dishwasher cleaner in the form of citric acid that says it can be added to the dishwasher as a cleaning aid when running a load of dishes but even that’s not 100%. On top of that I have been pulling out my filter in the bottom of the washer and cleaning it out before every use to give the washer the best shot at performance. I know the filter probably doesn’t have anything to do with the issues I’m having but I didn’t want to leave anything to chance. After this pouch of dishwasher pacs is out I’m gonna go back to dishwasher powder for the first time in more than 10 years. Thank you again.

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FranklySean 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Thanks for these videos on dishwashers! I'm getting a much better result for less money and time spent!

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RadicalEdward37 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

So i figured i should throw in my own personal anecdote here for posterity. My mom bought this new dish washing liquid, finish, as opposed to the cascade she always gets and right around that time the cups started to get weird bits of dryed on food stuck on them, it was to the point where i honestly thought the dishwasher might be broken. My mom was convinced it was the dishwashing soap though, I suggested using a powder detergent as you do and lo and behold the first load that came out after we switched was completely clean, no stuck on food.

We hypothesized that the finish detergent was mostly water which is why it didn't clean that well but i honestly didn't think something like that could have such a big impact on the cleaning ability of the dishwasher. Again, this is just my experience so take it with a grain of salt but i figured i should report in. My mom also suggested you do a video about how to clean your oven, lol.

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Oh Globbits 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

What am I supposed to do with all those finish Powerball tabs I have?!

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Kylemon 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

wanted to say I agree that your captioning work is immensely appreciated and wonderful, also you're the only channel that will get me to click on a second video about dishwashers that's following up on a previous video about dishwashers

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Kef103 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Wow , those pods are way cheaper at aldi. Seriously aldi brand is $3.50 for a pouch of 18 pods that are just like the cascade.

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Kef103 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I just break the corner of the tablet with my fingernail as I’m putting it in the dispenser , letting some of the powder fall on the door and Voilà in one graceful motion your problem is solved.

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LaigledeMeaux 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

At 43:00, you ask why people asked that question. I would be one of those, and my answer is, I already have pods. I stocked up on pods at one point and now am inundated with them. Even if they don't work the best, I still have them, and don't want to throw them out as I paid for them.

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Adam Sensabaugh 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

You should discuss how much laundry detergent to use in a he washer

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Adam Sensabaugh 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

My coworker freaked out me, I was talking about wanting to purchase a home with a dishwasher or at least room to install. She was like”I don’t understand why it’s so hard to do by hand”

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Adam Sensabaugh 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

Danby has a portable dishwasher with a built in softener. Sold in America

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Redfuchs 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I make my one Dishwashmixtur;

*1 x Washing soda
*2 x Sodium carbonate

*teaspoon

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Suripat Patsuri 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

In Brazil, a dishwasher still is not a very popular appliance since remote times. The first ones that popped during the 80s were not very efficient and left a last impression on consumers. Today, if the Brazilian currency was equivalent to the Dollar, you could buy your entry level dishwasher for $2000. Some models cost over $5000.00. There's that.

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MrTitaniumDioxide 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

There are a lot of recipes available for homemade dishwasher detergents and rinse aids. They're cheap, simple-to-make and I'd dare say safer and friendlier to our environment. Typical ingredients: washing soda, baking soda, citric acid, borax, Epsom salt, kosher salt, essential oils and distilled (white) vinegar. Also, a bit of a no-brainer, but if you use paper napkins, it's simple to give plates and bowls a quick wipe into the trash can while clearing the table to reduce dried-on food and get better results from your dishwasher.

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Abstract Approach 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I've always thought of them as big drying racks. I have a feeling your "landlord specials" have been of much better quality than mine. Never had a washer/detergent combo that actually cleans.

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Dominique Heino 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I loved this video. Thank you for the subdued snark

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Ian Tait 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

How is it that you can get loose powder in a cardboard box over there? It's difficult enough to find powder on the shelf at an Australian supermarket, but they're all in wasteful plastic jugs. Other bulk options still come out close to AU$10/kg.
I use a smaller bench top dishwasher so tablets are even more excessive with the detergent dosing.
Also, there's so much marketing about a rinse aid being included in the powder. This doesn't make much sense, as how can it neutralise the detergent after the wash is done if it's already in the wash.

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My Opinion 24/11/2021 - 4:04 Chiều

I had a circuit board problem and repair tech told me use white vinegar for a rinse aid .100% great for keeping the interior clean also 🙂

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